As a possible solution to my previous post about issues with 4.20K CS and Remote Desktop. Is it kosher to have a mixture of Client/Server 4.20K and Native 4.20K clients accessing the same data files and using the same wbserver.dat file?
I am asking this because this particular server has local users using Client/Server and that must remain. I was looking to have those accessing with Remote Desktop run the Native version since they will already be authenticating with their RDP session.
For those wondering. Accessing the Client/Server remotely without RDP is not an option. I am aware that could be a consideration.
Mixing Client/Server & Native
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Mixing Client/Server & Native
Steve Koger
Computer Specialist
SEKESC-MACS Division
Computer Specialist
SEKESC-MACS Division
While BR maintains data integrity with Client/Server and Native clients sharing the same data & using wbserver.dat, there may be a performance problem.
The simple rule is no user/application should Open the data files over a network connection (Mapped, UNC, etc.)
If any application does open the files over the network, then Client/Server performance will be significantly hit because the file server will stop caching the data.
In other words, if the data is actually on your "Remote Desktop Server", and you setup BRCONFIG.SYS to use the 'C:' (Or whatever the real drive is), then it's ok.
The simple rule is no user/application should Open the data files over a network connection (Mapped, UNC, etc.)
If any application does open the files over the network, then Client/Server performance will be significantly hit because the file server will stop caching the data.
In other words, if the data is actually on your "Remote Desktop Server", and you setup BRCONFIG.SYS to use the 'C:' (Or whatever the real drive is), then it's ok.
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Thanks Luis for the quick response!
The RDP server is the Fileserver.
So I can make sure I understand what your saying. If currently my drive statement uses this:
\\mappserver\macs\vol002
Then I will take a performance hit on the C/S clients
If I change my drive statement to use:
c:\macs\vol002 instead then my CS clients will not take a hit?
The RDP server is the Fileserver.
So I can make sure I understand what your saying. If currently my drive statement uses this:
\\mappserver\macs\vol002
Then I will take a performance hit on the C/S clients
If I change my drive statement to use:
c:\macs\vol002 instead then my CS clients will not take a hit?
Steve Koger
Computer Specialist
SEKESC-MACS Division
Computer Specialist
SEKESC-MACS Division
I'm not sure I understand.
If I have 3 computers:
F - fileserver
L - local networked computer
R - remote internet connected computer
Then if L connects with Standard BR and maps dirves to the network fileserver, both in the operating system L: for example is a network drive on F that is mapped on L's computer and is referenced in L's BRCONFIG.sys
and
R connects to F over the internet not using terminal servcies, but does no drive mapping on R, but the BRCONFIG.sys that CS uses based on R's logon does refer to the F drive locations in a similar manner to L's
What happens?
Is ther degredation? If so, is there a remedy?
Thank you for the insight.
FNGeorge
If I have 3 computers:
F - fileserver
L - local networked computer
R - remote internet connected computer
Then if L connects with Standard BR and maps dirves to the network fileserver, both in the operating system L: for example is a network drive on F that is mapped on L's computer and is referenced in L's BRCONFIG.sys
and
R connects to F over the internet not using terminal servcies, but does no drive mapping on R, but the BRCONFIG.sys that CS uses based on R's logon does refer to the F drive locations in a similar manner to L's
What happens?
Is ther degredation? If so, is there a remedy?
Thank you for the insight.
FNGeorge
Yes, use c:\macs\vol002 instead of \\mappserver\macs\vol002
Not only with CS be very happy, but distributed will be MUCH FASTER!
I hadn't mentioned a terrible problem with Windows 2008 and SMB2, but using "MAPPED DATA" on a 2008 machine when using RDP can cause terrible problems! (Terrible Microsoft Bug!)
You should also make sure that your Client Server ALSO uses c:\macs\vol002 instead of \\mappserver\macs\vol002
Again, CS will be MUCH FASTER if you use a local drive.
Not only with CS be very happy, but distributed will be MUCH FASTER!
I hadn't mentioned a terrible problem with Windows 2008 and SMB2, but using "MAPPED DATA" on a 2008 machine when using RDP can cause terrible problems! (Terrible Microsoft Bug!)
You should also make sure that your Client Server ALSO uses c:\macs\vol002 instead of \\mappserver\macs\vol002
Again, CS will be MUCH FASTER if you use a local drive.
If I have 3 computers:
F - fileserver
L - local networked computer
R - remote internet connected computer
F is the File Server where the data is stored, for the best performance, no user should ever open any data using UNC or MAPPED drives.
L & R should both use Client Server to run your application, and the CS config.sys should point to the "C:" Drive (Actually the real place where you map your data.).
Here is a Sample CS CONFIG.SYS
Drive F,C:\cs\,X:\,clsinc
The application is installed on the File Server in the C:\cs folder "C:\cs\clsinc"
The Workstations map:
X: to \\cls-2008\CS
My application uses the "Virtual F:" drive.
To answer your question, if any application (not just BR) opens any of your data files (Even Read Only) using the Network (Even if the application is on your "F" File Server), then Windows completely disables the CACHE, so performance decreases significantly.
The only remedy is for 100% of your program to only open the data directly on the "C:" drive of the server.
BR Client Server can easily accomplish this, just use the "C:" drive in your CONFIG.SYS.
BRNative cannot be used at any other location that the actual file server because the 'C:' drive is only available on that machine.
Of course Performance is relative, so you might not care, but the difference is enormous with 30 to 100 times improvement using the "C:" drive over the "\\ UNC Drive".
[/img]
F - fileserver
L - local networked computer
R - remote internet connected computer
F is the File Server where the data is stored, for the best performance, no user should ever open any data using UNC or MAPPED drives.
L & R should both use Client Server to run your application, and the CS config.sys should point to the "C:" Drive (Actually the real place where you map your data.).
Here is a Sample CS CONFIG.SYS
Drive F,C:\cs\,X:\,clsinc
The application is installed on the File Server in the C:\cs folder "C:\cs\clsinc"
The Workstations map:
X: to \\cls-2008\CS
My application uses the "Virtual F:" drive.
To answer your question, if any application (not just BR) opens any of your data files (Even Read Only) using the Network (Even if the application is on your "F" File Server), then Windows completely disables the CACHE, so performance decreases significantly.
The only remedy is for 100% of your program to only open the data directly on the "C:" drive of the server.
BR Client Server can easily accomplish this, just use the "C:" drive in your CONFIG.SYS.
BRNative cannot be used at any other location that the actual file server because the 'C:' drive is only available on that machine.
Of course Performance is relative, so you might not care, but the difference is enormous with 30 to 100 times improvement using the "C:" drive over the "\\ UNC Drive".
[/img]
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Thanks! I have known to shutoff SMB2 when I had a mix of XP machines and 7 or Vista, but are you saying I need to shutoff SMB2 even if I am doing a share to myself on the server if it 2008 server?
GomezL wrote:Yes, use c:\macs\vol002 instead of \\mappserver\macs\vol002
Not only with CS be very happy, but distributed will be MUCH FASTER!
I hadn't mentioned a terrible problem with Windows 2008 and SMB2, but using "MAPPED DATA" on a 2008 machine when using RDP can cause terrible problems! (Terrible Microsoft Bug!)
You should also make sure that your Client Server ALSO uses c:\macs\vol002 instead of \\mappserver\macs\vol002
Again, CS will be MUCH FASTER if you use a local drive.
Steve Koger
Computer Specialist
SEKESC-MACS Division
Computer Specialist
SEKESC-MACS Division
Yes Sir, any network share including Terminal Server on 2008,
Frankly SMB2 is a terrible mess, and I recommend always turning it off.
** Note: Don't "Share to Yourself" on the Server, if you really must have a "Specific Drive", use the "SUBST Command"
SUBST F: C:\CS
The Subst command makes "F:" behave very much like C:\CS or a "Map Rooted Drive".
You will notice huge performance gains if you use the "Local Drive" instead of a Network Drive.
Remote Desktop in Win 2008 also has some terrible bugs when a "Mapped Drive" shares data between more than 1 server session. This is regardless of the SMB 2 patch. This only applies to running an application over Terminal Server directly on the server, and Mapping Drives. (SUBST or LOCAL DRIVE work just fine!)
Frankly SMB2 is a terrible mess, and I recommend always turning it off.
** Note: Don't "Share to Yourself" on the Server, if you really must have a "Specific Drive", use the "SUBST Command"
SUBST F: C:\CS
The Subst command makes "F:" behave very much like C:\CS or a "Map Rooted Drive".
You will notice huge performance gains if you use the "Local Drive" instead of a Network Drive.
Remote Desktop in Win 2008 also has some terrible bugs when a "Mapped Drive" shares data between more than 1 server session. This is regardless of the SMB 2 patch. This only applies to running an application over Terminal Server directly on the server, and Mapping Drives. (SUBST or LOCAL DRIVE work just fine!)